[Lee in Limbo]

Originally Posted by AFGNCAAP

I think if they had gone for all the trouble of re-editing something specifically for the trailer, they would have opted for something less mundane than a main character walking across the room. So I have to believe that's an actual in-game scene, and an actual in-game animation. (It doesn't bother me, though!)

As a side note, I wanted to say that this is a rather inconsiderate dismissal of the many excellently paced and edited silents. Is the clock scene in Safety Last! herky jerky or painfully slow?

Perhaps not, but we could make a really dull game out of listing which movies did or did not have a 'proper' frame rate in the silent era.

As for the effect they used in the trailer, I do believe it is just that; an effect. I believe so because at least two of the scenes that they showed us were identical to images we saw in the screenshots, which were fully coloured. It might seem cool and stylish to take a fully rendered and coloured game and then run it through your Adobe programme of choice to make it look like an old black and white from the silent era, but it will limit the number of people who pick it up. As well, why wouldn't they have given us some black and white screencaps by now? I could see them producing a few classic newsreel clips, but it seems extremely unlikely that they would desaturate an entire game.

[Ascovel]

I don't mind slightly unnatural in-game animations as long as there are many of them and they present something beyond only the standart actions (walking, talking etc.). I don't remember when was the last time I've seen a 3D character model manipulate some object in a more complex manner than moving it with a Jedi hand motion or taking it away by glueing it to the arm.

[AFGNCAAP]

Originally Posted by Lee in Limbo

Perhaps not, but we could make a really dull game out of listing which movies did or did not have a 'proper' frame rate in the silent era.

Either you are mixing a couple of issues here, or I misunderstood you (or both). Although you did say "frame rate" in your previous post, the rest of it made me think you were using the term loosely, and referring to purely artistic decisions. Obviously films today tend to use, say, shorter cuts and more close-ups than they used to, especially in action sequences. That doesn't mean today's standards are higher or lower, only different, and that is what I was trying to say, bringing up just one of many sequences that turned out truly captivating despite not using "modern" methods.

On the other hand, if we are talking actual technical term that is frame rate, you are absolutely right that the standards have changed since, or rather, that a single 24 fps standard has been introduced to cinema projectors (it does not extend to TV or games). However, it is still not the issue of the past filmmakers using "improper" one, or lacking the know-how to capture the smoothness of movement. The silents should seem smooth enough for the human's eye if displayed at the frame rate they at which they had been originally shot - it's just that they usually aren't. (In fact, nor were they necessarily back then, but that's another story.)

As for the effect they used in the trailer, I do believe it is just that; an effect. (...) I could see them producing a few classic newsreel clips, but it seems extremely unlikely that they would desaturate an entire game.

Yes. I meant specifically the character animation, not the lack of colour.

Getting back to the game, upon rereading Marek's preview and interview, I started to wonder when did Mata Hari disappear from the Hype-o-Meter (it used to be there, right?). The premise and setting are original and very adventure-y, the backgrounds are real eye-candy... And is it just me, or is it so far shaping up fresher than anything currently on H-o-M in terms of gameplay? I hope there will be more trailers soon, which reveal some tidbits about how espionage, dancing and the dialogue/inventory system work.

[eriq]

Well I think this game looks sweeeet. Very detailed. Very stylish. And, most of all, it's got Hal Barwood involved. He's gonna show us how it's done the RIGHT way - something adventure games need right now.

Could we ask for anything more? I think not. Bring it on!

I only wish I could design the box for this gorgeous game.

[Nigel Danvers]

World War I period and they took the trouble to get the clothes right ...though Mata Hari's underwear looked ickily modern (sigh, I guess any glamour other than last week's American Idol version is lost on most folks)
I'm looking forward to playing this, and it doesn't even have ghosts!
I reckon if I could get my head around The Lost Crown's er...interesting...character animation this should be just fine.
Hopefully the story will help suck me in.

[Ascovel]

Originally Posted by Nigel Danvers

World War I period and they took the trouble to get the clothes right ...though Mata Hari's underwear looked ickily modern

Maybe this particular underwear just stood the test of time .

[Jackal]

Originally Posted by AFGNCAAP

I started to wonder when did Mata Hari disappear from the Hype-o-Meter (it used to be there, right?).

Used to be there, will be there again. A few too many months of no updates of any kind were responsible for it sliding. The latest pics and trailer will put it squarely back on the radar again.

[jp-30]

(Reposted from my news entry at mixnmojo.com)

The game's possible German release date, plus a few other details on Amazon.de have been revealed.

Release date: November 21 2008
Platform: Windows XP / Vista
Price: E39.99

The Mata Hari on the box art has become a little less 'historically accurate' than the teaser art rendering or the real thing, it would seem.

No word yet on when the English version might be released.

[eriq]

What do you guys think of the box art? I think it's gorgeous. Beautiful artwork. What a temptress.

[jp-30]

I think she looks too much like a modern day American stripper, and not enough like an 'olden days' exotic dancer.

But I understand the marketing behind her new appearance.

[AndreaDraco83]

Originally Posted by jp-30

I think she looks too much like a modern day American stripper, and not enough like an 'olden days' exotic dancer.

But I understand the marketing behind her new appearance.

I agree with you: she is way too much modern, a sort of Playboy pin-up, or a Baywatch's lifeguard-y Pamela Anderson with black hair. She totally lacks any mysterious charm, any seductive feeling nor she does seem exotic, erotic or dangerous. Only vulgar.

It it is indeed the final draft of the box art, I would be surely disappointed, although, as jp-30 said, the marketing reason behind this choice is quite evident.

[Lee in Limbo]

I think the cover looks quite lovely. However, I am inclined to agree that the degree of bare skin is indicative of modern trends, rather than any historically accurate attire for dancers of that era. Also, the model doesn't have the body shape 'attractive' women of that period were generally portrayed as having. They seem to have decided their target audience is going to be age 16-25 males.

I think it's actually pretty cynical of the developers to have decided to try to sell the game with such an obvious piece of cheesecake. It bespeaks a lack of faith on the part of the producers for their product. I would have preferred a cover that showed her in at least one other outfit, making it clear that it's not all corsets and garters (or belly dancing outfits, as I think they were trying for in this image). I guess they just felt that the dresses and even the lingerie of that period wouldn't appeal to as many people today, though I'm inclined to think they're wrong.

Still, I am looking forward to the game itself.

[Squinky]

*gags*

I think I've lost all the respect I had for this game.

[AndreaDraco83]

The more I look the more I feel ashamed for the publishers. I can only hope that this isn't the final cover, and that they're going to change it.

[Squinky]

Ah well. At least it makes for good blog fodder.

I should note that I don't mean to put down people who find the lady on the cover attractive. Just that, as many of you have already said, it's inappropriate. And you really have to admit that even if she's hot, it's still contributing to the rampant sexism in advertising that exists today. I mean, how often do you see men dressed and posed in a similarly seductive fashion, anyway?

[Ascovel]

I don't mind Mata Hari's attire (too much ), but I think the cover drawing is generally rather poor, mediocre at best (the colors, the composition, Mata Hari's plain looks). Fortunately, the look of the game itself is different from it.

[jp-30]

The early teaser rendering, while still with a 'modern' body shape - thin waist, flat belly, thin arms & legs and thin nose and with skimpy clothes seems much more exotic and truer to the actual person than the cheescake on the box-art. A bit less "Slave Leia" or playboy pinup.



Still, it's not like the box art (or teaser) costume itself is totally out of place. There were times when plenty of flesh was on display;



And again here

[Ascovel]

Originally Posted by Squinky

And you really have to admit that even if she's hot, it's still contributing to the rampant sexism in advertising that exists today. I mean, how often do you see men dressed and posed in a similarly seductive fashion, anyway?

Call me sexist, but men are not able to be seductive in this sort of way. They would be plain ridiculous posing like that. Is that because the society is sexist or the society is sexist because of this? I don't know.

[Squinky]

Originally Posted by Ascovel

Call me sexist, but men are not able to be seductive in this sort of way. They would be plain ridiculous posing like that.

Except in magazines targeted at gay men. But we all know gay men are ridiculous, right?

Originally Posted by Ascovel

Is that because the society is sexist or the society is sexist because of this? I don't know.

The former. Definitely the former.

[Ascovel]

Originally Posted by Squinky

Except in magazines targeted at gay men. But we all know gay men are ridiculous, right?

Let me say it like this: man who aren't posing for magazines targeted at gay men, but behaving like they were, and thinking while doing it that they are sexually attractive to women and role models for other men are ridiculous. Personally, I think that all magazines targeted specificly at men (gay or not) are rather ridiculous, but perhaps it's better not to go there...

Originally Posted by Squinky

The former. Definitely the former.

Perhaps you're right, but I hope you don't think that every representation of a woman behaving seductively in a womanly fashion is somehow depreciative for women in general? Actually, this is probably the core of the sexism problem - men (and women too) looking down at women who are able to be attractive. When people start branding Lara Croft as a representation of a woman without any value, a virtual toy for some men, it only encourages people to treat like dirt real persons who have similar physical atributes, even if they personally evaluate them as sexually atractive.