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ASA - Remastered Edition

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crabapple - 01 April 2015 12:44 PM

I’m disappointed in GOG. The only recent 1st person games they sell have 3D movement (unplayable for anyone who gets motion sickness from FPS-style movement). And with one exception (Return to Mysterious Island), GOG doesn’t even have the 1st person adventures that were made by Kheops. Nor do they have Shivers, though they sell 3rd person games made by Sierra. They sell new retro-style 3rd person games, as well they should. But they reject new retro-style 1st person games even when they come available.

I would say either they don’t like 1st person games, or they think they don’t sell as well as 3rd person adventures. Anyone have the stats on this? It’s hard to understand accepting totally mediocre fare like ‘A Golden Wake’ (which is neither ‘good’ nor ‘old’) and neglecting classics like Shivers, Timelapse or Obsidian.

     
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Oscar - 01 April 2015 11:54 PM
crabapple - 01 April 2015 12:44 PM

I’m disappointed in GOG. The only recent 1st person games they sell have 3D movement (unplayable for anyone who gets motion sickness from FPS-style movement). And with one exception (Return to Mysterious Island), GOG doesn’t even have the 1st person adventures that were made by Kheops. Nor do they have Shivers, though they sell 3rd person games made by Sierra. They sell new retro-style 3rd person games, as well they should. But they reject new retro-style 1st person games even when they come available.

I would say either they don’t like 1st person games, or they think they don’t sell as well as 3rd person adventures. Anyone have the stats on this? It’s hard to understand accepting totally mediocre fare like ‘A Golden Wake’ (which is neither ‘good’ nor ‘old’) and neglecting classics like Shivers, Timelapse or Obsidian.

To be fair, part of it probably also has to do with developer relationships. A Golden awake is only there I bet because Wadjet Eye Games publishes it, and they might have some leeway with GOG.

     
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Sometimes indie devs do release some sales statistics on how they’ve done in Steam and other venues. This is an older one about Defender’s Quest, which was somewhat popular tower defense game: http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/186940/defenders_quest_by_the_numbers_.php

Considering how game sales usually go, it propably has had its most sales when it has hit GOG, so taking account the time lapsed and sales and such I’d say it has most likely made at least 3k more units in sales. So list GOG games in order of bestselling, locate the Defenders Quest and you can do some not so accurate assumptions on how the rest of the games in the list have sold. It’s of course a lot of guesstimation, but if you locate other sales figures you can get at least some kind of an idea.

     
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In their last email to me, GOG has not closed the door for my next game Catyph, and I am curious to see what will happen in a few months, if they will accept it or not.
I am still wondering if I should continue on my own or try to find a publisher interested in my games. Publisher Lace Games was interested in Catyph last year, and I had refused this cooperation because they were taking a very big % of the sales, and also I was building The Icehouse collective during this period. But it seems that Lace has had good results with Lifeless Planet.

Do you find it important when you buy a game from me (or another very small indie dev) that there is no publisher, or on the contrary that there IS a publisher? Do you like to know where your money goes, for example? Or to feel that the project is very personal?
It was my own decision to work alone until now, because this way I have no deadlines and I’m totally free to do what I want in my games - but on the other hand it’s a lot of troubles for few results. If I want to continue making games this way, it will probably be very difficult.

I don’t think GOG are reluctant to 1st person adventure games. Games like Xing or Obduction will probably release on GOG and make good sales, because they are beautiful, popular and made by famous people (in the case of Obduction). They’re just expecting such a game to have a good business plan, which is obviously not the case of ASA. That’s also why it’s so interesting to have the Adventure Gamers Store, as long as they accept all adventure games without distinction.

     
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In my opinion you do the deal you can life with yourself. If that’s an issue for someone, then that’s entirely their own problem.

     
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Simon_ASA - 02 April 2015 05:32 AM

Do you find it important when you buy a game from me (or another very small indie dev) that there is no publisher, or on the contrary that there IS a publisher? Do you like to know where your money goes, for example? Or to feel that the project is very personal?

I generally buy games purely based on whether or not I believe I will enjoy the game, there might be a few exception where I have bought a game to support a small indie developer, but getting a publisher certainly won’t scare me away.

     

You have to play the game, to find out why you are playing the game! - eXistenZ

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Simon_ASA - 02 April 2015 05:32 AM


I am still wondering if I should continue on my own or try to find a publisher interested in my games. Publisher Lace Games was interested in Catyph last year, and I had refused this cooperation because they were taking a very big % of the sales, and also I was building The Icehouse collective during this period. But it seems that Lace has had good results with Lifeless Planet.

I hope Lace Games is not another name for Lace Mamba? If it is, start running as fast as you can! Lace Mamba has ripped off several developers.

Do you find it important when you buy a game from me (or another very small indie dev) that there is no publisher, or on the contrary that there IS a publisher?

No. That’s up to the developer(s).

 

     

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Simon_ASA - 02 April 2015 05:32 AM

Do you find it important when you buy a game from me (or another very small indie dev) that there is no publisher, or on the contrary that there IS a publisher? Do you like to know where your money goes, for example?

I do like knowing my money is going to the developer.
In the past, publishers have ripped off developers—not just taking a cut of sales, but taking everything.
http://www.vg247.com/2013/02/12/lace-mamba-implicated-in-non-payment-piracy-scandal/

I do prefer having a professionally pressed game disc because they last longer than home-burnt discs.

I don’t think GOG are reluctant to 1st person adventure games. Games like Xing or Obduction will probably release on GOG and make good sales, because they are beautiful, popular and made by famous people (in the case of Obduction).

Xing and Obduction are both modern style realtime 3D games, not “retro” 2D or point-and-click.

I have no problem with GOG offering the Wadjet Eye games and I’m glad they’re available. I’d just like to see more new 1st person point-and-clicks like Asa on GOG (as well as more of the older ones from the 1990’s).

 

     
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Thanks for your replies, it’s very helpful.

I hope Lace Games is not another name for Lace Mamba? If it is, start running as fast as you can! Lace Mamba has ripped off several developers.

Yes, Lace Games is related to Lace International (formerly Lace Mamba). I know that a lot of developers were angry against them, and I discussed this point with Jan Kavan (J.U.L.I.A.) and read several articles here and there about the problems that occured. It was also one of the reasons why I refused to work with them. However they (Lace) assured me that they had learnt from their mistakes (...), and that they had totally changed their policy. After discussing this point with David Board (Lifeless Planet), he told me that he was satisfied of his cooperation with Lace. That’s all I know for the moment.

     
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Saying you have learned from your mistakes is the easiest thing in the world. Maybe they have, maybe not. Lace Games is obviously also targeting poor, struggling indie developers. Their address in Brighton is the same one that Lace Mamba and Jason Cobb used.

You should talk to Jonathan Boakes as well. He got burned by more than one publisher. Just saying…

     

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I agree with Karlok.
Another consideration is that even if you trust Lace, many of your potential customers won’t, and will not purchase anything they publish.

     
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Yes, let’s not forget Lace Mamba ripped off gamers as well. Far too many buyers never got the game they paid for. Lace Mamba promised and didn’t deliver.

     

See you around, wolf. Nerissa

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Yes you’re right Smile Anyway I have already refused their offer…

     
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As far as choosing between going with a publisher and going solo, that is a very tricky one.
Many considerations should be taken first:
- How much marketing money and visibility are they willing to give me?
- Will I keep my IP?
- Do they have deals with other outlets like GOG to make my game available there?
- Do they have a good reputation? The last thing you want is people getting pissed off at you because of the publisher’s antics.
- Will I make more money after their huge cut, than I probably would if I went solo?

Sometimes you may want to go with a good publisher just to get your name out, like I am a good developer and I make good games. Once people have tried your game, they will know who you are, and the next game you make solo will be more recognized. It’s not an adventure game, but Supergiant Games had Warner Bros publishing Bastion. It got way more media coverage than it would have if they went solo. Now that lots of people know who they are, they went into self publishing for their next game Transistor. Granted that is one of many scenarios things can pan out.

I do feel where you are now though. The gaming market has never been as competitive as it is today. You have more than a million Apps on the app store, games selling for 0.99 cents there, thousands of games on Steam, and not to mention the competition from other media sources like television and movies that are all fighting for the consumers’ dollars. Getting visibility is more difficult than ever. In my last job, our company team worked with Jeff Tunnell’s team on a social facebook game, and I heard how difficult it was for him to get one of his games visible in the App store (That is THE Jeff Tunnell of Dynamix fame). If you are not part of the top 50 or so on the App store, your game is pretty much invisible. My company used to pump thousands to hundreds of thousands of dollars (probably more than the cost of development) just to get as many ad banners on websites as possible. Even then, they also had good relationships with the Apple folks to try to get the games in the Top 50.

He went with his next game on Steam, because he said there is many more ways for people to find content there. I do frequent Steam a lot though, and looking at the Greenlighted games everyday, there are LOTS of really good looking games in all genres being greenlit daily. To stand out is REALLY hard, which is why a publisher might be beneficial just to get recognition.

Sorry for the long rant but that’s my 2 cents (actually more like 2K dollars Tongue).

     
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Karlok - 01 April 2015 04:18 AM

What is the best-selling game and how is the AG store doing?

The best-selling game is the first epiosde of The Adventures of Bertram Fiddle. You can see the top 5 when browsing the catalogue.

As for how the AG store is doing, that’s a question for Marek…

     

The truth can’t hurt you, it’s just like the dark: it scares you witless but in time you see things clear and stark. - Elvis Costello
Maybe this time I can be strong, but since I know who I am, I’m probably wrong. Maybe this time I can go far, but thinking about where I’ve been ain’t helping me start. - Michael Kiwanuka

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