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Broken Sword 5 - Episode 2

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Iznogood - 24 April 2014 03:21 PM

Yes but that has nothing to do with the actual translation of the text, only how we interpret the text, which is otherwise done automatically by Nico (as I recall).

Lol sorry, I edited my post but too late. What I think is that actually what you’re doing is making small leaps in meaning to reach a set of instructions that are useful to reach the destination. So if George had been translating the text as an academic exercise, surely translating that as “south” would’ve been wrong. But instead when looking for a set of steps, what makes sense it just put “south” so you end up with a neat set of instructions you can follow on the map.

     
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Hehe I also made a small edit to my post too late, reflecting your edit…

Anyway I don’t really think we disagree that much, I just never managed to make sense of it.

     

You have to play the game, to find out why you are playing the game! - eXistenZ

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I had to apply some brute-forcing to solve that bit myself, so I see what you mean. Grin

     
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George does give a clue if you try to solve it before the map puzzle by saying something like “you need to know the locations before solving this” so the player knows he needs to be looking at the map

     
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Iznogood - 24 April 2014 03:12 PM

It is suppose to be [spoiler]directions to a place written in an ancient language or some sort of hieroglyphs, meaning that the symbol will have to always mean south, at least in the context of giving directions. Now it could of course mean “looking towards the region of the Young City” which makes sense, but then the translation “south” is actually incorrect as that would depend on your position.[/spoiler]

But if it’s true that south is referring to the map in your inventory, then is the only symbol whose solution directly comes from it. Everything else is pure logic reasoning and general knowledge, like the beautiful beginning-sun-end = day.

     

Recently finished: Four Last Things 4/5, Edna & Harvey: The Breakout 5/5, Chains of Satinav 3,95/5, A Vampyre Story 88, Sam Peters 3/5, Broken Sword 1 4,5/5, Broken Sword 2 4,3/5, Broken Sword 3 85, Broken Sword 5 81, Gray Matter 4/5\nCurrently playing: Broken Sword 4, Keepsake (Let\‘s Play), Callahan\‘s Crosstime Saloon (post-Community Playthrough)\nLooking forward to: A Playwright’s Tale

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diego - 24 April 2014 04:01 PM

But if it’s true that south is referring to the map in your inventory, then is the only symbol whose solution directly comes from it. Everything else is pure logic reasoning and general knowledge, like the beautiful beginning-sun-end = day.

Yeah but, while beginning-sun-end=day makes sense in the language itself (ie. if you found it in any other text in that same language, it’d still mean “day”), look-YoungCity-region=South is George’s own extrapolation. It’s a leap in the puzzle-solving logic.

     
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wilco - 24 April 2014 03:50 PM

George does give a clue if you try to solve it before the map puzzle by saying something like “you need to know the locations before solving this” so the player knows he needs to be looking at the map

Unfortunately I looked at the map before trying to solve the translation puzzle, so I never got that clue.

diego - 24 April 2014 04:01 PM

But if it’s true that south is referring to the map in your inventory, then is the only symbol whose solution directly comes from it. Everything else is pure logic reasoning and general knowledge, like the beautiful beginning-sun-end = day.

Yeah that is also my own problem with that, though I can accept ZeframCochrane’s leap in the puzzle-solving logic.

     

You have to play the game, to find out why you are playing the game! - eXistenZ

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Iznogood - 24 April 2014 05:19 PM

Yeah that is also my own problem with that, though I can accept ZeframCochrane’s leap in the puzzle-solving logic.

I gotta say, the leap is quite arbitrary. Perhaps the puzzle could’ve been designed on two levels, first level being finding the in-language meanings (eg. beginning-sun-end=day, fire-region=desert, witness-beginning-city-region=look at the Young City region) and on top of that a level of extrapolation of the required steps to reach the destination (look at the Young City region = Look South).

     
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Funny stuff, but only from Santa Cova cave and onwards I’m able to walk and browse through my inventory at the same time.

     

Recently finished: Four Last Things 4/5, Edna & Harvey: The Breakout 5/5, Chains of Satinav 3,95/5, A Vampyre Story 88, Sam Peters 3/5, Broken Sword 1 4,5/5, Broken Sword 2 4,3/5, Broken Sword 3 85, Broken Sword 5 81, Gray Matter 4/5\nCurrently playing: Broken Sword 4, Keepsake (Let\‘s Play), Callahan\‘s Crosstime Saloon (post-Community Playthrough)\nLooking forward to: A Playwright’s Tale

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Finished it. It is true the last quarter of the game is somewhat weaker probably due to rushing things and meeting deadline, but it wouldn’t be fair to say it takes too much away from the general enjoyment. I’ll write more thorough review (the game definitely deserves at least 3.5 or 4 stars mark) but I’ll keep my attention on some neatpicks:


For example, even though the whole Middle East part was a stretch goal originally, it felt a bit flat, starting from the background desert drawing (the pale coloring) and the fact that the whole part encompasses of only two locations and the ending cutscene. I would have welcomed for example to search for the location by myself in the vein of Fate of Atlantis, starting from the larger main city like in BS1, especially because the game started to get that authentic Indiana Jones feel once finding the cave and working out the symbols. The ending itself evokes the memory of BS3 ending, though I still felt that Langham had more potential to it, we’ve not properly learned of his motives etc. though on the other hand - compared to BS1 where we’re introduced to the main villain only at the end, at least we crossed our way with Langham during the course of the game. Shears getting the change of heart is a nice touch, but there wasn’t really any further surprises in the plot - BS5 is one of the rare mystery games where you’re sure of the identity of the main bad guy halfway through the game. I’m not saying that’s necessarily a bad thing, but perhaps they could have kept us guessing a bit more.. Also, it’s a bit illogical for Langham to kill the old guy instead of George - George is the one always one step ahead of him. Also, why George stepped so close when using gun on Langham - I thought he’d just yell “Drop the gun!” from few steps away, not allowing Langham to recognize the fake.

As for the “goat joke”, I had other problem with it - it is not whether the goat survived or not, and whether it’s all a joke or not, it’s that the joke itself is not suited for a last punch before switching to credits. (it’s OK for George to be a “jerk” from time to time, but after George says it, Nico is bizarrely smiling and just minutes before she wanted to kill George for even thinking to put the dynamites on the goat). We may even argue that the game treated that goat almost as a side character, so also in that sense, avoiding any “animal rights” discussion, it felt a bit off (and that’s why I was waiting for “after the credits” - to see the goat chewing on that sausage Grin)


Of course, the, once again masterfully researched story and really above-average puzzles is what makes the bulk of an adventure game, and in that regard BS5 is nothing but a success.


BTW, don’t you think we’re screwed with the Kickstarter trend because of the ending credits? Grin - I had to sit for half an hour until every one of backers was listed (and we were “cheated” for “after the credits” scene Cry)

     

Recently finished: Four Last Things 4/5, Edna & Harvey: The Breakout 5/5, Chains of Satinav 3,95/5, A Vampyre Story 88, Sam Peters 3/5, Broken Sword 1 4,5/5, Broken Sword 2 4,3/5, Broken Sword 3 85, Broken Sword 5 81, Gray Matter 4/5\nCurrently playing: Broken Sword 4, Keepsake (Let\‘s Play), Callahan\‘s Crosstime Saloon (post-Community Playthrough)\nLooking forward to: A Playwright’s Tale

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I liked the Shears character too, but after the waiter at the cafe my first reaction to him in London was “Oh no, not another philosopher!”. Two is too much.

diego - 25 April 2014 07:22 AM

BTW, don’t you think we’re screwed with the Kickstarter trend because of the ending credits? Grin - I had to sit for half an hour until every one of backers was listed (and we were “cheated” for “after the credits” scene Cry)

I was hoping for a nice extra scene too, didn’t have your patience though.

     

See you around, wolf. Nerissa

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Well, I’ve just finished the game, and I really enjoyed it. I’d say it’s my second favourite in the series (1 > 5 > 3 > 2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4). After the awful BS4, I seriously doubted that Cecil and co. had a good game left in them, and I’m glad BS5 proved me wrong.

I really like George and Nico’s relationship. At this point, they just know that life will keep throwing them together from time to time to save the world all over again, and they just roll with it. I don’t really want them to become a permanent couple. The idea that they just keep bumping into each other, going on crazy adventures, and are completely unfazed about the whole thing is what makes their dynamic so fun in my mind.

I replayed the first part before moving on to the second, and I’m glad I did. The game feels like a cohesive whole, and it’s definitely meant to be experienced this way. Still, I liked the second part more. Broken Sword is the exact opposite of Tex Murphy: it really shines in the “Indiana Jones” sequences and tends to be a bit more dull in the investigative parts. The extra puzzle difficulty was an added bonus. (And I’m proud to say I solved the whole thing entirely without hints.)

The final confrontation was completely daft, but at this point it wouldn’t be Broken Sword if it weren’t. But I liked the final scene; Shears absolutely needs to return in future games (Pearl and Duane, on the other hand, can go take a long walk off a short pier). I like that the game’s final word is “goat”.

Speaking of which: to those who didn’t try to get rid of the guards by using the goat as a suicide bomber (only to be prevented by Nico): WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU??? How can you not want to do that???


By the way, I have a question: Why was the game called The Serpent’s Curse? Clearly, it’s a reference to El Serp, the guy who painted La Maledicció, but that side of the story was pretty much left unexplored in the game. I’m guessing they changed their minds about how the story should go between the Kickstarter (which is when they announced the title) and the moment they finished the game. Oh well.

     
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Kurufinwe - 25 April 2014 12:03 PM

Speaking of which: to those who didn’t try to get rid of the guards by using the goat as a suicide bomber (only to be prevented by Nico): WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU??? How can you not want to do that???

I did want to but Nico had already confiscated my weapon collection. I don’t think it matters what you try to do with it, she won’t let you.

By the way, I have a question: Why was the game called The Serpent’s Curse?

Ouroboros, eternity symbol in Gnosticism. It’s in the painting and it is mentioned several times.

     

See you around, wolf. Nerissa

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Plus the fact that the painter was called ‘El Serp’ and La malladicio translates to curse.
Not sure in what language now(I presume Catalan), but in Spanish curse would be ‘la maldicion’.

See what they did there? Heheh

     
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I’ve just finished both Serpent’s Curse and Moebius and the best way to express my feelings towards them would be that Moebius is a perversion and Broken Sword is a beautiful sex.

I will add more impressions when the emotions cool down a little.

     

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