Fate of Atlantis - IQ Points

[Huz]

I've just finished replaying Fate of Atlantis for the first time in at least nine years - fantastic game, as demonstrated by my (rather disappointing!) total recall of the Team path!!

The game has these 'IQ Points' which increase for every puzzle you solve, on any of the paths. This means you can go back, choose a different path through the game (or even solve some puzzles differently, I suppose - there are a few places with multiple possible solutions) and eventually accumulate all 1000 points if you see everything. This seems like a great idea for aiding replayability, and it's certainly part of the reason I'm going to go back and redo the Wits and Fists paths as soon as I can.

I find it odd that other adventure games (even subsequent LucasArts adventure games) don't implement something similar, unless there are some I've missed. Why not? No point because most adventure games don't have branching paths? Or was simply nobody interested?

I think it's worth drawing a parallel between this concept and the 'Gamer scores' (or whatever!) introduced with the Xbox 360, where you get points for your Xbox Live account by attaining various 'achievements' in games. This is obviously more worthwhile for non-adventure games, where it's possible to 'complete' a game but only finish 50% of the available missions (see the GTA series), but there's no reason it can't be applied to adventure games too. I'm sure it's possible to finish an adventure game without speaking to whole characters (or at least only scratching the surface of the available dialogue), and in the case of Fate of Atlantis it's even possible to avoid solving some puzzles altogether - although the ending is less satisfactory!

Anyway, partially a "wooo Fate of Atlantis" thread, partially about the IQ points. I think it's a real shame nobody has picked them up and made use of Atlantis's branching/alternative solutions/optional puzzles schtick.

Edit - and ok I've just realised that just about every Sierra game has 'points' ;) - but then Sierra games are crap :devil: - but I don't think they have multiple paths, and the points serve only to demonstrate how close to the end of the plot you are? Correct me if I'm wrong!

[AFGNCAAP]

Um, lots of adventure games had point system in the past; much fewer recently, but Return to Mysterious Island and Voyage come to mind.

I don't really see any corellation between the point system and alternative branches, though. As you said, the points could simply be used to keep track of your progress in an ultra-linear game just as well. (Although you are wrong about Sierra games: they had a lot of optional stuff to do)

[Kurufinwe]

I don't really see any corellation between the point system and alternative branches, though. As you said, the points could simply be used to keep track of your progress in an ultra-linear game just as well. (Although you are wrong about Sierra games: they had a lot of optional stuff to do)
Yes, but the difference is that you weren't rewarded for the optional things in Sierra games; the way the score system worked only encouraged you to find the perfect path. This is different from the system in FOA, which made you try everything, both the clever solutions and the less clever ones, as well as explore all three paths, to get the perfect score. I think it's better.

[AFGNCAAP]

Yes, but the difference is that you weren't rewarded for the optional things in Sierra games
How so? I clearly remember getting points for doing things not necessary to complete the game.

[Kurufinwe]

How so? I clearly remember getting points for doing things not necessary to complete the game.
'Optional' might not have been to perfect word... Take the dragon in KQ1: you can either kill it or use a more peaceful and clever solution. Both will get you points, but if you want to get the perfect score, you have to do the latter.

Now, in FOA, there are lots of similar situations (with guards), but, while the clever solution gets you more points, you have to do both to get the perfect series score. So you're encouraged to do both, instead of finding the right one.

Same thing for alternate paths. KQ6 doesn't encourage you to replay it taking the short route into the palace, since you know you'll get a terrible score for doing so. In Sierra games, all alternate solutions feel like mistakes; in FOA, you're encouraged to try all, even if some are less rewarding than others.

[Ariel Type]

Huz
I find it odd that other adventure games (even subsequent LucasArts adventure games)
Indiana Jones and the Last Cruisade also has IQ Points. Fate of Atlantis just inherited this system.
And yes, there are lots of other "point" games :)

[AFGNCAAP]

Now, in FOA, there are lots of similar situations (with guards), but, while the clever solution gets you more points, you have to do both to get the perfect series score.
So you can load back a saved game and add points to your score by applying an alternative solution?

[Kurufinwe]

So you can load back a saved game and add points to your score by applying an alternative solution?
Exactly. There's an 'episode' (?) score that only keeps track of the current game, and a 'series' score that is stored independently from the savegames and requires you to find all possible solutions to puzzles (on all three paths) to reach the maximum score (1000). According to my calculations (possibly wrong, but not by much), the maximum 'episode' score you can reach in a playthrough is 641, quite far from the 1000 points of the series score.

(Wait a minute, does that mean you haven't played FOA?)

[AFGNCAAP]

Exactly. There's an 'episode' (?) score that only keeps track of the current game, and a 'series' score that is stored independently from the savegames and requires you to find all possible solutions to puzzles (on all three paths) to reach the maximum score (1000). Based on my calculations (possibly wrong, but not by much), the maximum 'episode' score you can reach in a playthrough is 641, quite far from the 1000 points of the series score.

(Wait a minute, does that mean you haven't played FOA?)
:o Could be... :P

I played The Last Crusade, though, and I assumed the "series score" would keep track of the sum of your scores in both games.

Anyway, is the series score feature "compatible" with ScummVM?

[Kurufinwe]

:o Could be... :P
AFGNCAAP
Well, go play it instead of posting stuff on forums. :P

Anyway, is the series score feature "compatible" with ScummVM?
It works in FOA (I'm not sure whether you can take the file with your score from the original interpreter and use it in ScummVM, though). It still doesn't in Indy 3 (and nobody really seems to care about it, which is a shame).

[Phatsacks]

The Legend of Kyrandia (by Westwoods Studios), had a point system. However, it wasn't for alternate paths, but rather for hidden easter egg style secrets. I don't think the next two had points though.

p.s.

Hello! First post, long time adventure player~

[Huz]

Hey Phatsacks, welcome to the forums!

Kuru, what are your 'calculations' based on? I'm going to go through all three paths to see how close I can get to 1000 points, but since I'm on 655 halfway through Fists (having already done Team), I doubt I'm going to be anywhere near!

[Kurufinwe]

Hey Phatsacks, welcome to the forums!

Kuru, what are your 'calculations' based on? I'm going to go through all three paths to see how close I can get to 1000 points, but since I'm on 655 halfway through Fists (having already done Team), I doubt I'm going to be anywhere near!
I made a list of all the points to be earned in the game, so then it's just a matter of figuring out which actions are mutually exclusive (and which get you more points). There are lots of points to get on the Fists path, because it's often possible to either fight a guard or get rid of him in a more clever way.

As I said in the thread I've linked to, I've always been 17 points short, because I could never beat Arnold and the prison guard. But maybe you'll fare better than I. :)

[Huz]

I made a list of all the points to be earned in the game, so then it's just a matter of figuring out which actions are mutually exclusive (and which get you more points). There are lots of points to get on the Fists path, because it's often possible to either fight a guard or get rid of him in a more clever way.
Oooh man, that's hardcore to ATMachine proportions! ;) (No offence meant to either of you!)

Very interesting though. Did you discover these by trial and error? I must admit, looking at how many puzzles and possible solutions there are, I'm less inclined to go for the maximum score... but very impressed at the number of variations there are in the game. I had no idea there were so many ways to solve many of these puzzles!

I'm becoming more and more impressed with Fate of Atlantis the more I look at it... its Amiga incarnation did it no justice at all, and I used to think it was pretty mediocre as a result. :( More fool me!

[Kurufinwe]

Very interesting though. Did you discover these by trial and error? I must admit, looking at how many puzzles and possible solutions there are, I'm less inclined to go for the maximum score... but very impressed at the number of variations there are in the game. I had no idea there were so many ways to solve many of these puzzles!
Well, the game is almost 15 years old, and it's one of my favourite games, so I've played it lots of times. Although I did figure out most of this by myself, there are some alternate solutions I remember reading in walkthroughs.

And it's not that difficult to make such a list, because the file that the game uses to store the score is very easy to understand, so you can follow the game 'filling the blanks' as your score rises. And, apart from a couple of things that were probably added late in development (such as the car chase), the actions are pretty much stored in the game order, so, when you're missing one, it's very easy to know in what part of the game to look.

It was the first time I actually bothered doing a point list of my own, primarily because I couldn't find one anywhere, but also because I really like the way the score works in FoA (see my post above). And, of course, the points are actually awarded for solving puzzles, not (as in the LSL and SQ games) for looking at some random items here and there, so it doesn't make it tedious to go looking for points.

And, yes, FoA is one of the best games ever. Everyone should not only play it, but also replay it -- preferably numerous times. :)